It’s undeniable that right now we are in a rapidly changing and complex relationship with the consumption, production, and reality of drugs, substances, and medicines, and their usage. This week, guest Ismail Lourido Ali, J.D. guides listeners through an overview of where we are in our relationship with drugs in the American context, and how this relationship is indicative of our relationship with the Earth and with humanity broadly.

Ismail and Ayana hone in on the consumption-driven mindsets that frame drug use within a capitalist context from so-called “party drugs,” to legalized cannabis use, and to the pharmaceutical industry. Importantly, much of this also comes in the context of  the war on drugs and its tragic ramifications including mass-incarceration and a general lack of support for those who use drugs.

We cannot move to a healthy and healing relationship with substances without acknowledging the violent realities brought about by criminalization, exploitation in drug production and consumption, and the exorbitant costs of pharmaceutical medicine. Ismail encourages us to move beyond the black and white view that some drugs are medicine while others are criminal, and instead encourages us to invite an understanding that drug use can mean many things and can provide a wide range of experiences. 

Allowing for nuance and context within this conversation also allows for broader visions and a radical imagination of what our relationships with substances could be if we consumed mindfully, understood where our drugs came from and how they were made, and gave proper reverence to their traditional uses.

This expansive conversation encourages listeners to ask what deep, collective healing looks like, and to reflect on complicated relationships with consumption across substances. As we think more deeply on these issues, we must ask: what voids are we filling, what imagination do we need to tap into, what kind of reconciliation and reparations do we need?

As MAPS’ Director of Policy and Advocacy, Ismail advocates to eliminate barriers to psychedelic therapy and research, develops and implements legal and policy strategy, and supports MAPS’ governance, non-profit, and ethics work. Ismail earned his J.D. at the University of California, Berkeley School of Law in 2016, after receiving his bachelor’s in philosophy from California State University, Fresno. Ismail has previously worked for the ACLU of Northern California’s Criminal Justice & Drug Policy Project, and Berkeley Law’s International Human Rights Law Clinic. Ismail is licensed to practice law in the state of California, and is a founding board member of the Psychedelic Bar Association. He also currently serves on the board of the Sage Institute, contributes to Chacruna Institute’s Council for the Protection of Sacred Plants, and participates on the advisory council for the Ayahuasca Defense Fund. He has also previously served as Chair of the Students for Sensible Drug Policy Board of Directors. Ismail is passionate about setting sustainable groundwork for a just, equitable, and generative post-prohibition world.

♫ The music in this episode is "Beam" by Harrison Foster, "If The Day Comes' by Book of Colors, and "Don't Be Afraid" by Autumn Hawk Percival.

Episode References

MAPS (Multidisciplinary Association of Psychedelic Studies)
”The World’s View on Drugs Is Changing. Which Side Are You On?” - The New York Times
”Colonization Laid the Groundwork for the Drug War” - Ismail Lourido Ali and Justice Rivera

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